[MG] Talk bubbles for crossforum theatre

Mon May 2 06:18:47 EDT 2011

On Sun, 01 May 2011 16:47, Alexander Praetorius wrote:
>
> The SVG's with the pizza slices are more for the "chicken 
> perspective"... if you want to explore the tree by navigating through 
> several branches.
>
> There is no meaning in the orientation of a "pizza".
>

I got that. Thats why I'm saying: if there was a meaning to it, it would 
serve as additional orientation for the users.

>
> There has to be a different view for the "eagles perspective", 
> ...maybe some kind of "circular tree map" ?
>

Ok, I wasnt aware, that you have to different types of maps in mind. Is 
that right? How would the eagle-map and the chicken-map be connected? 
Would they just stand side by side or would one morphe into the other 
and vice versa?

BTW, your email-text behaves really strange, when I try to quote it 
here. Sometimes many lines of cryptical symbols appear, when I try to 
delete part of your text.

Thomas

> *From:*start-bounces at metagovernment.org 
> [mailto:start-bounces at metagovernment.org] *On Behalf Of *Thomas von 
> der Elbe
> *Sent:* Sunday, May 01, 2011 12:54 PM
> *To:* alex at twister11.de; Metagovernment Project
> *Subject:* Re: [MG] Talk bubbles for crossforum theatre
>
> On Sat, 30 Apr 2011 15:20, Alexander Praetorius wrote:
>
> But while the "tiny pizza" is part of the path which starts from the 
> upper left, it's orientation is not important ...
>
>
> I dont know if it is very important, but I believe it might have at 
> least some importance (as well as the long names).
> Picture this: the top line of tiny pizzas is not a line, but a 
> pattern: the 2. is south of the 1., the 3. is east of the 2., the 4. 
> is north of the 3. ...
>
> So the tiny pizzas wont always be turned east and the user therefore 
> gets a better orientation of where he is. It was exactly this sort of 
> orientation, which I liked about most links, you gave in the context 
> of "eagles perspektive". You know? And they adressed even the problem, 
> of having 4-5 nodes of different trees expanded. They showed all trees 
> fully expanded right in the first view. I liked that.
>
> Thomas
>
>
> *From:* start-bounces at metagovernment.org 
> <mailto:start-bounces at metagovernment.org> 
> [mailto:start-bounces at metagovernment.org] *On Behalf Of *Thomas von 
> der Elbe
>
> *Sent:*Saturday, April 30, 2011 2:59 PM
> *To:* alex at twister11.de <mailto:alex at twister11.de>; Metagovernment Project
> *Subject:* Re: [MG] Talk bubbles for crossforum theatre
>
> Ok yes, thats how I understood it. Something is really cool about this 
> version! Its somehow more clear then the overlapping circles. And 
> because of the more space, we could have full names, which is also 
> very cool. But I feel, because the pizzas often rotate, the user gets 
> less of a sense of orientation. Do you agree?
>
>
> On Sat, 30 Apr 2011 14:45, Alexander Praetorius wrote:
>
> No, it all starts with the "Global" BIG PIZZA  in the center. ...it 
> contains a couple of slices.
>
> When you click a slice, the "Global" Pizza shrinks and moves to the 
> upper left and rotates, so that the clicked slice points towards the 
> center, where a new pizza appears which is details for the clicked one 
> on "Global".
>
> Now you can click a new slice, so the current slice will shrink and 
> move to the upper left, next to the global pizza. The global pizza 
> will rotate, so that the "branch" you took on global will now point to 
> the upper left moved pizza, and the upper left moved pizza where u 
> just clicked on will point towards the center, where another new pizza 
> appears....
>
> ....
>
> You can repeat this process, filling the top row or multiple rows with 
> tiny pizzas, while the current pizza you are interested in is always 
> at the center of the screen.
>
> Now if you want to go back to where you started, you could just click 
> on one of the tiny pizzas which represent your 
> "C:\folder1\folder2\folder3\..." and instantly the tiny one will go to 
> the center.
>
> *From:*start-bounces at metagovernment.org 
> <mailto:start-bounces at metagovernment.org> 
> [mailto:start-bounces at metagovernment.org] *On Behalf Of *Thomas von 
> der Elbe
> *Sent:* Saturday, April 30, 2011 2:27 PM
> *To:* alex at twister11.de <mailto:alex at twister11.de>; Metagovernment Project
> *Subject:* Re: [MG] Talk bubbles for crossforum theatre
>
> Alex, in your example you pick the east pizza-slice a couple of times 
> and then the south one. What would happen if you pick north, west ...? 
> Will the pizza be automatically be turned around to east again? But 
> this would probably make the user loose orientation, about where he is 
> in the whole tree, wouldnt it?
>
> Thomas
>
>
> On Fri, 29 Apr 2011 16:08, Alexander Praetorius wrote:
>
> I made a small example...
> ...its about "pizza slices" and about getting "rid of abbreviations" and
> about "chicken perspective", but not about all the stuff I've given in the
> example URL's of my previous message to this mailinglist.
>   
> It's also not perfect regarding accurate drawing, choosing colors that can
> be read well because they do not compete with the background color.
> There is much room for improvement. The main features are:
> 1. Shows taken path through the voting-tree (like
> c:/programs/votorola/whatever/...)
> 2. Shows details of focused current node
> 3. Removes unintuitive abbreviations
> 4. Reduces visual clutter
> 5. blablabla ;)
>   
>   
>   
> -----Original Message-----
> From:start-bounces at metagovernment.org  <mailto:start-bounces at metagovernment.org>
> [mailto:start-bounces at metagovernment.org] On Behalf Of Alexander Praetorius
> Sent: Friday, April 29, 2011 2:11 PM
> To: 'Metagovernment Project'
> Subject: Re: [MG] Talk bubbles for crossforum theatre
>   
>
>     Your idea of the pizza slices, was that to eliminate the complicated lines
>
> in
>
>     the center (above), or in the periphery (attached)?  Or both?
>
> Both :)
>   
> ...
>
>         FIRST - (The Ugly Abbreviations)<<
>
> I think a very very important thing is to get rid of the ugly abbreviations
> (Bo. No. Rh. Aq. Pa. .....) we might try something like this:
> http://www.brainpickings.org/index.php/2009/08/10/mbti-map/
> http://www.neoformix.com/2007/OntarioElectionViz0.png
> Right now, the abbreviations are absolutely meaningless. A person who's
> looking at the visualization doesn't know what kind of information to
> expect. Why would I want to navigate through the branches? What am I
> searching for?
> Maybe I'm searching for a branch where I could have more impact if I follow
> that branch? ...what's (Bo. No. Rh. Aq. Pa...) all about?
>   
>   
>
>         SECONDLY - (Eagle's Persective)<<
>
> I think the visualization we are talking about right now is more from a
> chickens perspective... you navigate through the tree step by step. It's not
> easy to see more than 3 or 4 branches at once, because at the moment, the
> screen will become way to cluttered to understand the current visualization
> with maybe 4 or 5 expanded "nodes".
> So if we also will go for an overview visualization we might try something
> like:
> http://lip.sourceforge.net/ctreemap.html  (circular treemap)
> http://bund.offenerhaushalt.de/  (treemap)
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/marc_smith/1474524836/  (treemap)
> http://www.neoformix.com/2006/MLPC_p4.gif  (sunburst diagram)
> Another visualization combines circular treemap with crosslinks, but I don't
> know if there is use for something like this
> http://neoformix.com/2009/TorontoTwitterCommunity.html
> http://www.neoformix.com/2009/ttcs_1.png
> http://www.neoformix.com/2009/ttcs_2.png
> http://www.neoformix.com/2009/TwitterEmployeeClusters.jpg
>   
>   
>   
>
>         THIRDLY - (Different Approach)<<
>
> A completely different approach might list all polls in a menu-like-list and
> while you hover over the polls, they become highlighted in the main view.
> The filled circles attached to each poll will show you the (Bo. No. Rh.....)
> and their diameter will tell you how much votes they have donated:
> http://www.neoformix.com/2008/AuthorLine.png
>   
>   
>
>         FOURTHLY - (TAG Approach)<<
>
> The center of a branch could be written like a heading (eg. "America").
> The "child nodes" could be written as weighted TAGs
> (eg.states,president,...)
> http://www.neoformix.com/2008/CloudComparison2.html#SummaryEnd
> (Clicking a Tag will open a sub branch and the path from root node down to
> the current branch could be shown through something like (root:G / p / moo /
> Bo. / ...)
> But please try to use meaningfull names  like (Global / Polls / Joe's Cow /
> Boring Abbreviations / ...)
>   
>   
> Other Stuff:
> http://wallstats.com/deathandtaxes/  (mindmap with zoom&pan)
> http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2008/05/05/science/20080506_DISEASE.html
> (zoomable node-link-diagram)
> http://www.notcot.com/images/2008/04/Literary-Organism-Poster.jpg  
>   
>   
>   
> -----Original Message-----
> From:start-bounces at metagovernment.org  <mailto:start-bounces at metagovernment.org>
> [mailto:start-bounces at metagovernment.org] On Behalf Of Michael Allan
> Sent: Friday, April 29, 2011 11:06 AM
> To:start at metagovernment.org  <mailto:start at metagovernment.org>
> Subject: Re: [MG] Talk bubbles for crossforum theatre
>   
> Thanks Alexander,
>   
> This drawing of the center came from one of your earlier suggestions:
> http://zelea.com/project/votorola/a/crossforum/vote/_/1c.xht
>   
> I like it.  I think it's faster on the uptake than this one:
> http://zelea.com/project/votorola/a/crossforum/vote/_/1.xht
>   
> Your idea of the pizza slices, was that to eliminate the complicated lines
> in the center (above), or in the periphery (attached)?  Or both?
>   
> (Will reply to your other points, soon.  An, Ji, Th, etc. are  people's
> names.)
> --
> Michael
>   
> PS - the SVG source is here if anyone else wants to draw:
> http://zelea.com/project/votorola/a/crossforum/vote/VotespaceV.svg
>   
>   
> Alexander Praetorius wrote:
>
>     Wow :-)
>
>       
>
>     It's getting better and better.
>
>     I like the geomap and I also like the bubbles, which tell visitors its
>
>     real people talking and not just bots or something...
>
>       
>
>     I still hate the abbreviations (Ge. Fr. An. ...) What's there meaning?
>
>     Countries?
>
>     Can't we then use flags and tell people the country's name when
>
>     hovering the flag?
>
>     (What flag do we use for global  (G.)? Maybe a planet earth icon?)
>
>     Really, I think there must be something done about the annoying
>
>     abbreviations. They really look very nerdy and cryptic to an average
>
>     visitors eye.
>
>       
>
>     I like the circles, the cyan navigation highlighting, the numbers and
>
>     the percentages :) I don't like all these lines because I think they
>
>     generate visual clutter and so do the ugly Abbreviations ;)
>
>       
>
>     Maybe one could use colored pizza slices, where the intensity of the
>
>     used color indicates the percentage given to the "pizza center" by each
>
> slice.
>
>       
>
>     ...when a user nagivates through the branches of the tree, the active
>
>     circle maybe should go to the center of the screen while the former
>
>     circles should "fade out" or "shrink" a little ..or both? ...or they
>
>     should auto-move to the top of the screen, creating a "row of circles"
>
>     which are similar to G/p/bla ...
>
>     ...they would just show the path a user took while navigating through
>
>     several branches of the tree.
>
>       
>
>       
>
>     -
>
>     Alex
>
>   
>   
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